Shock horror, cried this week’s papers. 101,000 drivers on Irish roads are on their 3rd, or subsequent, provisional license. Shock horror my arse! The dogs on the street knew that. Let me rephrase - the dogs on the footpath knew that - they are too smart to walk out on the street.
For non-Irish readers who want to know what is meant by a provisional license, or simply want to have a good belly laugh at an unbelievably stupid approach to learner driver licensing, take a quick look at the Dept. of Transport explanation.
The previous/current (which is it anyway?) government have been spouting rubbish for years about reducing waiting lists for driving tests. Clear the backlog. What would that achieve? What is the logic? Mary gets to take the test and passes. Great. It proves Mary is a capable driver. But she was a capable driver in the lead up to her test. She didn’t suddenly become one on the day. Joe takes the test and fails. He isn’t capable of driving. Simple as that. He isn’t capable of driving. One more time - he isn’t capable of driving. But what happens when Joe is given a piece of paper with FAIL on it? He drives (yes, drives) down to the local authority office and buys himself another provisional license. Now get this - if he is applying for a 3rd or subsequent provisional he can get a 2 year one. Work that out: Joe has failed the test twice. He isn’t capable of driving. But he is allowed on the road for another 2 years.
Joe must have a fully licensed driver accompanying him. Makes sense. But if Joe is on his 2nd provisional he doesn’t. Explain that to me. Joe must display an L sign on the front and back of his car. He cannot drive on a motorway.
Now Joe, lives in Newbridge and works in Dublin. He uses the M7 and M50 motorways each working day. Like the thousands of others in similar circumstances he takes down his L signs - he might be pulled by the cops on the motorway if they seen them. Joe’s father accompanied Joe a few times as the fully licensed driver, but he can’t travel to work with Joe every day. In fact, his father was really only ever in the car with him while he was teaching Joe how to drive. Joe never took lessons from a professional - they were expensive and anyway, he doesn’t have to under law.
So we have two major things wrong here. Firstly, the licensing system is a mess. It hasn’t changed a whole lot since the days when you just walked into the post office and bought one across the counter. The pathetic restrictions which are in place, are seldom never enforced. Drivers like Joe get stopped at the odd checkpoint and the cop glances at the tax, insurance and NCT discs and waves him on. Never is he asked for his license so he can continue on his way with no L signs, on a motorway and with no fully licensed driver in the passenger seat.
[ As an aside: What Joe fails to realise is that by not complying with these restrictions he is not insured. Uninsured. Just like the boyracers who fail to check the box on the insurance form which asks has the vehicle modifications/adaptations to increase top speed, performance or acceleration. Uninsured. This is something else those who draw up statistics ignore, as do the government who (should) act on them. Uninsured is usually calculated based on the number of cars registered less the number of people insured. ]
The media, government, AA, Gardaí, MADD and so on bombard us with statistics on road deaths. Fine. I’m okay with that. It is truly horrific and needs to be kept in the public’s mind if it is ever to improve. But we never see statistics on the number of minor incidents bandied about in this way. I’m talking about shunts and scrapes. Has anyone ever dinted your car at the supermarket because they can’t park? Do you know how much it costs for a new wing? Have you ever seen a car buried in a ditch because it was only a Micra and the driver was trying to take a corner at 70km/h because that’s the speed daddy takes it in his Mazda 6? Have you seen cars with the front battered in because the driver was just 5m behind a truck which had to brake coming to a corner - a corner the car driver couldn’t see because they were too close to see around the truck? I could go on. These cost billions every year. Billions.
I’m not blaming provisional drivers solely. But they have to play a part. Especially if they have failed their test many times. Most so called fully licensed drivers just got lucky on the day of the test. Others perform just for the test and ignore the rules thereafter. Many get no professional instruction whatsoever. There are advanced driving courses that can be taken. as with regular lessons there is no obligation to do them under law. Stranger still, what we call advanced lessons are the basic compulsory requirement in most other developed countries.
The last government never seen the bigger picture. (Their only answer was to reduce test waiting times). I doubt the incoming one will either. Their posturing about zero alcohol, 1litre engine size restriction and so on is merely patching a system which needs to be redesigned from scratch. Some of what they are proposing is simply not practical, the remainder will be unenforced as usual.
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Sounds like a system that’d drive you up the wall if the wall hadn’t been demolished by a 3rd time out provisional licensee.
In the US - Minnesota and California at least - there is no requirement that you demonstrate highway driving on your test. There’s no parallel park on it either and my teenage, fully licensed neighbour has no idea where her hazard lights are. They should be on her flaming forehead.
Quite right Sneeze, it’s abloody outrage. We’re letting non qualified driver whizz about in cars they are simply not experienced enough to drive. I would further put a cap on engine size for people who have not passed their test. See how racery the boys and girls are when they’re driving a one litre Micra. I honestly don’t think learner drivers should be driving powerful 2L engines. I drive a 2L but I”m driving a loooooong time and have a full license. Actually I’m thinking about taking that day long advanced driving course soon. Should be interesting.
Anyway, I don’t blame folk for driving without a license, they can’t bloody get a test, so IBTG*.
*I blame the governmnet.
I much prefer public transit and would be happy never driving again.
Sam - Pretty much the same here. But would I be correct in thinking that driving is easier in the US given the generally wider roads and the predominance of automatics? I can only go by my own experiences of Kansas City (KS) and Oakland (CA).
FMC - The advanced course is great. You’ll learn stuff like handling skids and moose avoidance. Most importantly you’ll learn (if you haven’t already picked it up from experience) how to truly anticipate and read the road - you’ll find you are braking less because you are ready for those lights to change, that car ahead to pull out, that you are taking corners in such a way as to give you the best line of sight (not speed) or that object you can just about see over the hedge ahead may be a slow moving tractor. Your passengers will complement your car (not you) for being so smooth - trust me on that one.
I’m not convinced on the 1litre cap. Kids will push those cars to the limit and get into trouble cornering as I mentioned for example. Now put a 1l engine in a heavy car designed for a 2l and you’ll slow them down, but also give them road holding. Not a practical option really I know.
Medbh - I’m with you on that. Unfortunately for me, like many others, it isn’t possible. The nearest train is 8km away and the nearest bus 3km. 3km isn’t far to walk, but it’s a damn dangerous road. I do it often and I never fear the oncoming car (going 10k over the limit) - what I fear are the ones tailgating it which can’t see me and on certain stretches there is nowhere to jump out of the way.
Well that explains the bus drivers in Dublin, crazy shites do they ever think that a double decker should slow doon when taking a corner?
We drive on runways in the US; people have no idea how wide their cars are or how to park them; in some states you don’t even have to have a front number-plate or a passenger-side wing-mirror.
I’m a crap driver by European standards now. When I’m in a car in Britain nowadays, I’m bobbing up and down and shrieking in the back like a mad Anglican vicar, convinced we’re narrowly avoiding roughly 14 crashes per street. I can no longer be sure I’ll parallel park right first time either. It’s all just point and press out here and it makes us all lazy, sloppy drivers. I like it though. Driving in Europe is hard, man!
When we were wee we thought it was funny when Americans tried to figure out how to work a passing place on a single lane Lewis road. One summer day we were coming back from the beach and there was a car blocking the road. We waited and waited until my dad got out of the car and found the American driver of the car in front trying to reason with a glassy-eyed sheep who was standing in the road. Seriously. My dad chased it off and we were soon all on our way. The Americans, though, were really grateful - it was a big ram and they’d been worried about being accused of disturbing the native fauna. My dad told them how to run at them shrieking and they really got into it. We all had nice tea together in a hotel on the way back into town and they turned out to be really lovely people. I say that because the man gave me 50p.
Young Knudsen - Yeah. And those bloody jarvies in Kerry too.
Sam - They have those parking spaces where you just roll up to the kerb too and when the wheels hit it you’re parked - no need to judge distance.
Love the sheep story. I took a visiting Japanese colleague out for a weekend drive in the Wicklow mountains once. The valleys, the heather, the waterfalls and the forests all went ignored. She was in complete awe of the sheeps [sic.] wandering across the roads.
Tell us, even though I can’t drive a manual thing, when I move back to Ireland later in the year, can I just produce my American driving license and swap it for a full Irish one without any testing?
Now I’ve no intention of driving, and shouldn’t be let in a car in Ireland, even an automatic (because driving conditions in different countries are unsurprisingly different - and the test I did here 8 years ago was a joke), but I am intrigued as to just how useless this system is.
Eolaí - Apparently not. From my local licensing authority website it would appear that automatic exchanges may only be made for licenses awarded by the following countries/states: Austria, Australia, Belgium, Capital Territory, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Iceland, Isle of Man, Italy, Japan, Jersey, Luxembourg, Netherlands, New South Wales, Northern Territory, Norway, Portugal, South Africa, South Australia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Tasmania, United Kingdom, Western Australia.
This seems to be South Africa, Japan and Australia plus the pre-enlarged EU and EFTA. Perhaps the site is out of date and the plus should include the EU proper and EFTA, which is the EEA.
Enough acronyms there for ya?
ps. The above website seems to be optimised for Microsoft IE. I used Firefox. Is it as screwed up in Opera as it is in Firefox?
I learned over here in cloggyland - cost me an absolute fortune because you are not allowed drive without a professional instructor - ever (until you pass your test). The tests are really strict also so you need at least 40 lessons. I’m still paying it all off. Halfway between the Irish system and this one would be good I reckon. One good thing about here is that they teach you how to drive on the motarway and that’s also part of the test.
Yep, in Opera it’s like the aftermath of a game in Janga.
I presume all the listed exchange countries have better systems of testing (I’m presuming that because they can’t be too much worse) so that’s a good thing. And it’s encouraging to know that my US license won’t automatically translate into an Irish license. I guess I’ll just have to go and get a provisional one. (If I wanted to drive that is).
How to avoid a moose? Awesome! The worst place I ever drove was Spain, those people are nuts.
Conorín - Now you’re talking. A system half way between the two would do very nicely thank you.
Eolaí - Fekin Council pandering to the corporates again. In this case Microsoft.
FMC - The moose test means veering around an unforeseen obstacle while maintaining control. Maybe in Ireland it should be the stray dog/bullock/horse test and in Spain the building/other vehicle/mountain test.
it is expensive enough to drive, after them bringing in that fucking theory test and the NCT and the ridiculous insurance prices why should they make it any harder